How to paint Hasslefree Minis?

[ErikB]

These minis are great - just beautiful.  But I am having a hard time painting them somehow on account of the very fine detail.

I'm used to a GW approach where I have a primer, undercoat, basecoat, wash, re-basecoat, highlight.

For example, a face would have black primer, dark flesh, foundation flesh, flesh wash, foundation flesh, then a mix of foundation with bleached bone for the highlight.

I'm having a difficult time doing this with the Hasslefree minis.  I looks a lot of the detail and, importantly, the wash just darkens the shade of the flesh.  It doesn't gather well in the recesses because they are so fine and made even shallower on account of the three+ layers already in place.

Similar problems with straps, shoelaces, and pockets and pouches.

So what should be done differently with these finer minis?  How have people adjusted painting techniques from GW minis?

Thanks.  I'm really trying to do Sadie, Tony, and Ashlee justice.

[Penfold]

Are you thinning you paint down or using strait from the pot ?

[wallybubs]

Wow thats a lot of layers of paint.

I do a really thin layer of undercoat in either brown, black or white, more to form the depth. Then I pay a lot of attention to the basecoat. Then wash, highlight and finally a tone down wash.

Keep everything watered down.

If you at first you dont succeed, get a jar, some acitone, a soft wire brush, stop reading the painting articles in GW, start again.

[ErikB]

I use some waxy-paper.  I take paint from the pot, add some water and/or flow improver, and paint it on.  My paints tend to be sometimes just a little too thin and require another layer (not always, I just err on the side of thinner paint).

I guess skipping the Dark Flesh layer would make sense.  Maybe using the thinner primer brand (not GW's) that doesn't do too well in wet weather might help.  That implies waiting until summer, though... 

[gi6ers]

I'm used to a GW approach where I have a primer, undercoat, basecoat, wash, re-basecoat, highlight.

Undercoat?

I think you've identified the issue yourself "It doesn't gather well in the recesses because they are so fine and made even shallower on account of the three+ layers already in place."

GW minis are generally a lot chunkier in detail so will take a lot more paint IMO.  If I look at your recipe for skintone:

"black primer, dark flesh, foundation flesh, flesh wash, foundation flesh, then a mix of foundation with bleached bone for the highlight"

It does feel like a lot of paint before you get going TBH, try a light spray of grey primer and then skip the dark flesh stage, you can then wash with whatever you like (GW washes?) and get on with your highlights.  Personally I use the foundation paints for basing but I know folks like SteveB seem to like them.

On the details again it's a different league, buy some smaller brushes 

Looking forward to seeing what you come up with!

[ErikB]

Thanks for the advice.  I'll try fewer layers and gray primer so they aren't so dark.

I think I got the details okay.

I took some photos with my phone camera and, strangely, they looked alright.  Go figure.  I'll post them soon.

[Ben Brownlie]

I use a similar approach to flesh. Black primer, Scorched Brown undercoat, Dwarf Flesh base coat then using thin paint I start at a SB/DF mix and add a tiny touch of green and add DF and then Elf Flesh for highlights

Don't seem to lose the details so must be the thickness of your paint

[alrith72]

Yep, best bit of advice i ever got on here was to thin my paints.

[somaticon]

With Hasslefree minis I tend to use foundation paints as undercoat then I build up using. Mix of ranges as GW colours don't always suit the scheme I'm working with.   

[caerban]

Just to be dull and follow the herd thin and numerous coats are better than fewer thick ones. Look at some of the best, certainly when it come to highlights and shadows, their brushes are barely even wet and they build up those colours slowly.

[Avicenna]

GW tend to have a dark --> light approach to their painting where they start at black and gradually work their way to the highlight. This is good, but definitely relies on a lot of patience if you want to keep the paint thin enough so as not to lose detail. SteveB and Ben get a great result in this way, but it isnt always the easiest approach.

I think Gi6ers works in a similar way to me - grey undercoat, then the mid-tone, and shade and highlight from there. Its all about the layers and doing it this way means that the paint doesn't have to give you 100% coverage with each layer. You just keep adding thin translucent layer upon thin translucent layer until you get the colour you want.

Someone once told me "Thin your paint until you think its enough, and then thin it a little more", and it seemed to really make a difference. You'll soon get used to how thin the paint needs to be.

[gi6ers]

I think Gi6ers works in a similar way to me - grey undercoat, then the mid-tone, and shade and highlight from there.

Just goes to show how different the results can be, and how the amount of time you invest in something pays off doesn't it? 

TBH I used to paint from dark to light but I find I can control the result a lot better with this technique and it's quicker for a lazy painter like me.

[Avicenna]

TBH I used to paint from dark to light but I find I can control the result a lot better with this technique and it's quicker for a lazy painter like me.

[caerban]

TBH I used to paint from dark to light but I find I can control the result a lot better with this technique and it's quicker for a lazy painter like me.

I'm also a grey-midtone-shade-highlight-glaze/wash to pull it all together type and so before you ask, if you want to give it a try, Halfords grey car primer

[tremorspin]

and when you guys are doing this do you apply the midtone across the whole area to be painted, or just to the areas where you want the mid tone? Presently I use the whole work up from dark in layers thing. Having just got some Hasslefree mini's I'll confess to having concerns about potentially wiping out subtle details by being heavy handed with the paint. So I'm loving this thread.

I use vallejo at present which seems a lot thinner by default than the coat d'arms / old school gw stuff I used to use and I do thin it down a bit with water. But I read some article where the author was talking about 3:1, 4:1 or more thining of thinner:paint and I don't get close to that... so should I be thinning more? And is there that much benefit to be had in using one of these fancy paint thining, applicator fluids over water (come to that do you use that stuff even)? I'm a long way from pro and figured such stuff probably require a certain level of skill before the benefit really kicks in.

[gi6ers]

and when you guys are doing this do you apply the midtone across the whole area to be painted.

Yup.  So this is your base coat, the other layers will naturally be thinner as you are just adding darker/lighter tones (with glazes or washes etc).

I thin my paints down to a milk like consistency (usually  ), I don't use anything other than water and I use GW's washes which thin well with water too IMO.

[ErikB]

My GW washes don't thin well.  They leave a dark ring, discolor the paint, don't go in the crevicess (like between fingers, where they are supposed to go), and leave spots.

Perhaps I am using hard/soft water?

I've thinned them with flow improver and that helps a little.

[Dagenhameast]

My GW washes don't thin well.  They leave a dark ring, discolor the paint, don't go in the crevicess (like between fingers, where they are supposed to go), and leave spots.

You're not thinning them anything like enough. When brushed on you should hardly notice the result, just build it up slowly in layers until you're happy.

[ErikB]

You're not thinning them anything like enough. When brushed on you should hardly notice the result, just build it up slowly in layers until you're happy.

No kidding?!?  Go figure.

I'll try thinner layers.

Does hard/soft water make any difference, by the way?  I see little flecks sometimes.

And how many layers of, say, Delvan Mud on a khaki base coat, is about right to shade in some uniform pants or a shirt?

Just a rough estimate: are we looking at 3, 8, or 20?

[Dagenhameast]

Does hard/soft water make any difference, by the way?

No. I'm in a seriously hard kettle-killing water area.... makes no difference at all

I see little flecks sometimes.

Are you shaking the pot first? The pigment does separate from the carrier and needs a thorough shake

And how many layers of, say, Delvan Mud on a khaki base coat, is about right to shade in some uniform pants or a shirt?

Just a rough estimate: are we looking at 3, 8, or 20?

How long's a piece of string? With really thin layers you can build up until you are happy.... that might be 5, 10, 20 et cetera. If you're using really thin layers you can't over do it; just takes a bit longer

[ErikB]

How long is a piece of string... I'll have to remember that one.

I posted some (very bad and very large) photos here: http://forum-of-doom.com/index.php?topic=14103.msg229924#msg229924

C&C would be great on these minis.

I can see using the very thinned wash to work on Ray's shirt and very thinned highlight on Ashlee's thigh.

I used the red hair instructions someone posted in another thread for Sadie's hair.  The camera focused on the base, not her head, but I couldn't tell until exploding the photo onto a computer screen.  The phone is tiny.

Thanks for all the advice, folks.

[Inso]

Prime...base-coat...wash...highlight (if you really have to ).

It isn't display standard but looks good in units .

[tremorspin]

How long's a piece of string? With really thin layers you can build up until you are happy.... that might be 5, 10, 20 et cetera. If you're using really thin layers you can't over do it; just takes a bit longer

Right... I'll be needing to change a few things in the way I work then. And I was pretty slow at this game before. Ah well I'm in it for the fun not spit out finished pieces on a deadline. And to be honest if it improves the results it will hardly be time wasted. Thank you for sharing.

[Avicenna]

Painting in numerous very thin layers is definitely more time consuming than Inso's method above, but it is really horses for courses... Inso's method will be a lot more durable than mine as the paint is thicker so may be more suitable for gaming, and is definitely better for getting a lot of models done. But if you are painting for the joy of painting and want a display piece at the end of it, then the layering technique is probably a good route to go down.

When painting in this way, you dont use a lot of paint on the brush like you would when washing colour over the mini, but paint it specifically where you want it to go. This way you dont get the colour pooling so it actually doesnt take that long to dry - you can even use a hair dryer if you need the layers to dry even more quickly.

[ErikB]

I'm trying the thinner layers.  It's really hard on raised surfaces like clothing.  The thin paint pools in the recesses instead of at the peaks.

Still experimenting....